WORLDWIDE Chapter 149 Message Board

rpnewman · Chapter Member

The British Horology Chapter is sponsoring an Early European Watch Exhibit at the Dayton National Convention that opens in a few weeks.

It features watches from the 1550s to the early 1700s.

I'm attaching pictures of a one-hand watch by Joseph Windmills that he made in the early 1680s shortly after the invention of the balance spring by Huygens in 1675. He preceded Thomas Tompion as Master of the London Clockmakers' Company in 1702 and his son, who became his partner, also became master in 1718.

The display includes 40 inch monitors with close-up photography, and a companion catalog that can be purchased at the gift shop table. All proceeds go to the museum.

Jon · Chapter President

I have several early Windmills watches, if you would like them posted. What other watches, makers are in the catalogue?

Tagline: what is that irregular brown covering your Windmills watch dial shown?

rpnewman · Chapter Member

Jon, I would absolutely enjoy seeing your early Windmills. Do you have any early Fromanteel-signed watches? That a family of makers that I’ve spent a lot of time researching. As to your question regarding the dial picture, its due to low resolution. The dial is original and perfect. The file I wanted to upload is very high resolution, 3024X4032, 4 meg but the upload facility wouldn’t allow it.

Back to the exhibit, I made the decision to focus this exhibit on features, materials, and artistry that tells the story of early watch development and would appeal to both the advanced and the beginner. There are 16th century drum watches, 17th century enamels, interesting dial configurations, alarms, repeaters, pre-balance spring and several from just after Huygen's invention such as this Windmills watch. I turned down Tompions, Quare’s and other famous names to try to keep the display focused on the objective - - unless of course it was a good fit. Could have had a much larger display, but sometimes more isn’t better and I didn’t want attendees to feel rushed since there are so many other activities (lectures, workshop, mart, craft contest) taking place.

Jon, also hope its okay to plug the business partners who decided to advertise in the exhibit catalog: Bonhams , Cogs & Pieces (www.cogsandpieces.com), Dr. Crott Auctioneers (www.muser-uhren.de), Jones & Horan (www.jones-horan.com), and Pieces of time (www.antique-watch.com).

Jon · Chapter President

In my opinion it cheapens the catalogue, but then everyone is doing it nowadays. Too bad.

rpnewman · Chapter Member

can't agree with that. I often find dealer adverts in particular to be quite interesting. AHS has been doing them for decades. Many on this forum wouldn't know, for example, that two of the best early English databases in the world are the on-line archives for the two UK dealers, Cogs & Pieces (www.cogsandpieces.com) and Pieces of time (www.antique-watch.com).

Anyway, thought I would post another Windmills by his son Thomas that dates to circa 1702-1705. Regulation through the dial is a feature that is seldom seen. This watch isn't in the exhibit because the one we do have in the exhibit also has a mock pendulum on the dial and that combination is even less scarce.

Jon · Chapter President

Fine, then, since it is all about the money.........how about this: why not open up things to all for ads; you know, the collectors with competitive rates for those sincerely interested in whatever the topic you and your people decide?

Obviously, none of the members here were offered the opportunity to participate
or to be included. Why not have a collector rate? Let's notice all to participate or be offered the opportunity to do so in the spirit of HOROLOGY!

(BYW, the famous and successful '76 Disneyland national convention display catalogue did not have any advertising or need for funds!)

Tagline: anyone have any '76 National convention catalogues available? Many collectors I know would like a copy.

StephanG · Friend of 149

Perhaps next time you could produce a pure horology only catalogue but place it inside a folding slip cover with a slot for the catalogue to live inside the back of the slip.

That way you could put as much advertising as you wanted on or in the slip cover, have a couple of pages in it if you like, but the horology part would remain pure.

Those who don't like adds could throw away the slip cover if they wanted but I have a feeling that in the fullness of time the complete ones would be more valuable.

The slip cover would also protect the catalogue within.

Everyone happy.

rpnewman · Chapter Member

"Fine, then, since it is all about the money"

This dialog is absurd. I'm sorry I posted anything here in the first place. I posted this to inform and talk about horology. I thought this was the English watch discussion. Is there anyone on this forum that actually wants to talk about horology?

Firstly, nobody involved in putting together exhibits or lectures are being compensated in any way. Secondly, its absolutely a great way to raise money for the museum, unless one happens to have an aversion to supporting our nation's museums. Lastly, as said in the first post, the exhibit was the work of the British Horology Chapter and all members of that Chapter received information about it and opportunity to participate. Many did. That's the source of the display. If you want to join, information is on the nawcc.org website and dues are a whopping 5 bucks.

As for the "famous and successful '76 Disneyland national convention display," that's nearly 50 conventions ago and hardly relevant to this thread. However, why not update and do that display again? Or, why not sponsor the re-printing of that catalog if it was so great? I'm sure everyone reading this would be excited if you did.

Jon · Chapter President

Sorry, sorry, sorry YOU missed so many points.

I think your response is absurd and argumentative--rather than respond to the questions presented you'd rather argue and become abrasive.

P and A:

None here were aware of such a catalogue until your post. (Thank you)

You brought up the dealer support and advertising.......no response. I asked about collector support and advertising....no response.

We would like a heads up on such opportunities to support or advertise..... no response.

Where did anyone mention compensation? response?

No mention was made about the origin of the catalogue! However, good for the BH Chapter. Who was uncharge of the project? Ae these available now?

Yes, we all here are supportive of museums and some members here have given huge sums to various museums. Maybe the association could begin a museum catalogue drive on various topics on a semi annual basis? If could prove to be both educational as well as profitable. (Look at some ideas generated here via this topic!)

The '76 catalogue IS RELEVANT because is what a comparison and an example of a pure educational format. It is also a historical document of value.

Do you own a copy of the '76 catalogue? Have you even read it? (I believe we printed 6 or 7000 copies--where did they all go?). Over 45 years later I am still receiving requests for this catalogue; therefore, I guess, it must still be relevant, kind sir!

Thanks for reading, folks.

Jon

Bryan · Chapter Member

HOWARD · Chapter Member

Indeed, the 1976 NAWCC convention was the best event display ever held. I know because I attended and experienced and viewed all of those great worldwide clocks and watches displayed. The superb convention catalogue was a testament to that event.

I think Jon's idea of a pure and non commercial semi annual catalog of watches and clocks is a fantastic one. It could serve multifold as 1. expert watch and clock articles with superb photos; 2. an educational tool for collectors; 3. formatted as a series like a bulletin but devoid of the usual commercialism and political hoopla; 4. it could generate new funds for the NAWCC or library; 5. a generated list of topics could be gathered for important subjects such as early English, French or Americans watch topics to be discussed, studied, and made.

This could prove to be a winner for all, the NAWCC and its membership.

Howard

doc ron · Chapter Member

to add to this discussion and about the 76 catalog I can enlighten those unfamiliar with it that many unknown and rare gems were displayed and photographed most importantly that greatest find of the 20th century the unique henry pitkin watch this is why many older references are so important to future researchers and collectors if you couldn't make the display the next best thing is to have the catalog

its called a library

doc ron

HOWARD · Chapter Member

Does anyone know the cost of the new early English book on watches?

How many pages and photographs does it have?

Thanks.

Howard

rpnewman · Chapter Member

HOWARD · Chapter Member