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WORLDWIDE Chapter 149 Message Board Forum Index » Pocket Watch Value Line for Collectors » watch estimates Goto page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next
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watch estimates
PostPosted: Sat Mar 24, 2018 12:04 pm Reply with quote
Jon
Chapter President
Joined: 02 Dec 2002
Posts: 27889
Location: Boston, Massachusetts




Pocket watch suction sales estimates are becoming as bad as the Price Guide!


Last edited by Jon on Sat Mar 24, 2018 12:52 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Jon "the truth" Hanson,
"playing" with watches now for 71 years
Founder and President of Chapter 149--the leading horological collectors' club!

American Horologe Co -- America's Most Respected Name
SUPPORT ETHICAL PRACTICES IN HOROLOGY--Keep watches original--DO NOT SWITCH, PART OUT OR "CREATE" POCKET abortions!
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 24, 2018 12:14 pm Reply with quote
geno
Chapter Member
Joined: 28 Oct 2005
Posts: 1805




It's really pretty simple as pertains to pricing, be your own expert and pay what you think it;s worth, nothing else matters. There is nothing worse than buying something you don't like based on some fairy tale price guide or auction result. You can get vastly different results for the same watch on different days or venues so comps are meaningless. The danger and I see this all the time is people not knowing and overpaying for bad condition or problem watches. You can't get years of experience from a guide, you have to put your time in the trenches. Geno
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 24, 2018 12:37 pm Reply with quote
Jon
Chapter President
Joined: 02 Dec 2002
Posts: 27889
Location: Boston, Massachusetts




AGREED and what I HAVE BEEN SAYING FOR DECADES.

HOWEVER and for some reason, AH seem to think they know prices which is a JOKE and a TRAP for novice collectors.

Twisted Evil Evil or Very Mad Idea

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Jon "the truth" Hanson,
"playing" with watches now for 71 years
Founder and President of Chapter 149--the leading horological collectors' club!

American Horologe Co -- America's Most Respected Name
SUPPORT ETHICAL PRACTICES IN HOROLOGY--Keep watches original--DO NOT SWITCH, PART OUT OR "CREATE" POCKET abortions!
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 24, 2018 12:51 pm Reply with quote
Bryan
Chapter Member
Joined: 29 Oct 2007
Posts: 3841
Location: OH




Jon wrote:
Pocket watch suction sales estimates are becoming as bad as the Price Guide!


If by "suction" you mean the loud sucking sound, indicative of the last gasp of American pocket horology, then yes, correct!


This gallery, once a good hunting grounds for clean and desirable watches for one's collection, has recently turned into an over-pimped website with an overwhelming amount of competition.

Aside from running of the Thursday night gold and other "higher" dollar items I seldom can buy anymore....

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Bryan Eyring
NAWCC#132532

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 24, 2018 1:21 pm Reply with quote
Jon
Chapter President
Joined: 02 Dec 2002
Posts: 27889
Location: Boston, Massachusetts




Just remember--for every all original straight watch, there are (probably 1-2000) recased, redialed, poorly repaired "smelleys."

Estimates are ALL WACKY. I have MY OWN value guide (65 years experience)!

_________________
Jon "the truth" Hanson,
"playing" with watches now for 71 years
Founder and President of Chapter 149--the leading horological collectors' club!

American Horologe Co -- America's Most Respected Name
SUPPORT ETHICAL PRACTICES IN HOROLOGY--Keep watches original--DO NOT SWITCH, PART OUT OR "CREATE" POCKET abortions!
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
PostPosted: Mon Mar 26, 2018 12:36 pm Reply with quote
Neilywatch
Chapter Member
Joined: 16 Oct 2010
Posts: 5836




My problem is a lot of people are going by these estimates instead of using their own judgement.

I am being forced to compete against that if there is something I really need or want. So even if I have my own idea of a value, unless I dont mind losing out, Im probably going to get outbid~~

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Neil - Crazy for Walthams!
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 26, 2018 2:58 pm Reply with quote
Jon
Chapter President
Joined: 02 Dec 2002
Posts: 27889
Location: Boston, Massachusetts




This is (and has been) one of the problems all along--it is the monkey see monkey do tactic.

If the damn watch is way overpriced because of some ignoramus, then DO NOT BID.

Worse yet is the situation when the book, mail, or internet buyer hasn't handed the goods and buys watches with problems not identified in the catalogue; OR, watches OVER DESCRIBED AND CATALOGUED BY IGNORANT CATALOGUERS WHO REALLY DO NOT KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT CONDITION FACTORS SUCH AS the "everything is mint" description disgrace! It is "mint" but used when received.

THERE IS NOTHING LIKE HOLDING IT IN ONE'S HAND AND KNOWING THE MARKET!

_________________
Jon "the truth" Hanson,
"playing" with watches now for 71 years
Founder and President of Chapter 149--the leading horological collectors' club!

American Horologe Co -- America's Most Respected Name
SUPPORT ETHICAL PRACTICES IN HOROLOGY--Keep watches original--DO NOT SWITCH, PART OUT OR "CREATE" POCKET abortions!
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
PostPosted: Mon Mar 26, 2018 8:29 pm Reply with quote
geno
Chapter Member
Joined: 28 Oct 2005
Posts: 1805




I like the fact that this game we are in is very hard to know and takes years to get a good feel for things. The disadvantage collectors or dealers have today is they just can't see what we saw starting 50 years ago. Condition, rarity, originality and the final pricing for the object took years of going to marts and spending summers in New England and combing auctions nationwide to get a real good feel or instinct. Stare and compare absolutely was critical, but staring and comparing at Marts nowadays is laughable, the goods just are not there in the magnitude of the past. If I started today, there is no way I would know what I know after 50 years in the future. The only advantage if you could call it that is newbies have no idea what they missed. I, along with others saw the golden age of pocket watches, that time is gone forever. Geno
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 27, 2018 5:13 am Reply with quote
PJR
Chapter Member
Joined: 01 Dec 2008
Posts: 2498




Ahhh, the days of roaming the weekly flea markets in NH with Bradly Ross, Garrett Nijssen, Fred Selchow, Maurice Richessen and more. Every week, one of us would find something great!
Paul
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 27, 2018 8:34 am Reply with quote
Neilywatch
Chapter Member
Joined: 16 Oct 2010
Posts: 5836




That begs the question:

In this new age - how does a new collector get himself in the right path, if according to you old-timers, everything is wrong with the hobby?

Pretty soon everything will be online, it will be more cost effective for most AH to do this. There is really no source of info for newer collectors to turn to - the price guide is considered by all the experienced collectors to be a joke. The current clubs are spreading misinformation, There are no more watchmakers, and the current group is not experienced enough in repairs - I could go on.

Any of you old-timers see any thing positive???

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Neil - Crazy for Walthams!
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 27, 2018 9:18 am Reply with quote
PJR
Chapter Member
Joined: 01 Dec 2008
Posts: 2498




Neil, switch to chronometers. They are difficult to fake and if the box has been switched it doesn’t matter too much as long as it is period correct. Besides when these came in for repair or traded in they were frequently mismatched with other boxes.
Just joking Neil
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 27, 2018 9:26 am Reply with quote
Jon
Chapter President
Joined: 02 Dec 2002
Posts: 27889
Location: Boston, Massachusetts




FIND A "real" MENTOR, and listen and learn!

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Jon "the truth" Hanson,
"playing" with watches now for 71 years
Founder and President of Chapter 149--the leading horological collectors' club!

American Horologe Co -- America's Most Respected Name
SUPPORT ETHICAL PRACTICES IN HOROLOGY--Keep watches original--DO NOT SWITCH, PART OUT OR "CREATE" POCKET abortions!
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
PostPosted: Tue Mar 27, 2018 9:28 am Reply with quote
Neilywatch
Chapter Member
Joined: 16 Oct 2010
Posts: 5836




Very Happy

I've always enjoyed pocket chronometers - maybe when I get my Wally book published - I'll start on those!

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Neil - Crazy for Walthams!
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 27, 2018 9:29 am Reply with quote
Neilywatch
Chapter Member
Joined: 16 Oct 2010
Posts: 5836




Jon wrote:
FIND A "real" MENTOR, and listen and learn!


Jon - there are very few "REAL" mentors left.

The few that are alive are - IMO - holding it close to the vest!

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Neil - Crazy for Walthams!
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 27, 2018 10:22 am Reply with quote
Jon
Chapter President
Joined: 02 Dec 2002
Posts: 27889
Location: Boston, Massachusetts




MOST IMPORTANT

Neil, are you forgetting that those who still collect don't give away much because then they would be completing against themselves!

Rolling Eyes

AND, let us be honest here, the dealers want the information to assist them in a tough business climate with little fresh goods except at auction where many of their customers bid.

Remember that many of the dealers are less knowledgeable than astute collectors. They need an edge. Major collectors WILL NOT GIVE THEM WHAT THEY WANT and why should they?

_________________
Jon "the truth" Hanson,
"playing" with watches now for 71 years
Founder and President of Chapter 149--the leading horological collectors' club!

American Horologe Co -- America's Most Respected Name
SUPPORT ETHICAL PRACTICES IN HOROLOGY--Keep watches original--DO NOT SWITCH, PART OUT OR "CREATE" POCKET abortions!
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
watch estimates
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