|  Chapter 149 Web Site |  Kirx Klox Special Project |  CH 149 MENTORS | 
CHAPTER 149, THE LEADING COLLECTOR'S HOROLOGICAL CLUB, ASSISTS AND EDUCATES ITS MEMBERS>>KEEP UP WITH CURRENT RESEARCH!
WORLDWIDE Chapter 149 Message Board

The original NAWCC internet chapter
established July 8th, 1990
President & Admin; Jon Hanson
Admin: John LaCambria

Chapter 149, protecting our passion one watch at a time!


Read our Standards of Conduct

login.php?sid=9a17969a52a4bbbae30ac8135da7dcab profile.php?mode=register&sid=9a17969a52a4bbbae30ac8135da7dcab faq.php?sid=9a17969a52a4bbbae30ac8135da7dcab search.php?sid=9a17969a52a4bbbae30ac8135da7dcab

WORLDWIDE Chapter 149 Message Board Forum Index » Case Discussions » case cleaning Chapter 149 discussion--here we go again! Goto page 1, 2, 3, 4  Next
Post new topic  Reply to topic View previous topic :: View next topic 
case cleaning Chapter 149 discussion--here we go again!
PostPosted: Wed Jun 03, 2015 4:19 pm Reply with quote
Jon
Chapter President
Joined: 02 Dec 2002
Posts: 25590
Location: Boston, Ma




http://mb.nawcc.org/showthread.php?124773-Question-about-cleaning-case

2 got it basically right--149 members!

Of course, the whole story was not given--how does a nephoyite clean a silver case?

No one told this fellow what NOT TO DO when cleaning!


Last edited by Jon on Sat Jun 06, 2015 3:49 pm; edited 1 time in total

_________________
Jon "the truth" Hanson
Founder and President of Chapter 149--the leading horological collectors' club!
American Horologe Co -- America's Most Respected Name
SUPPORT ETHICAL PRACTICES IN HOROLOGY--Keep watches original--DO NOT SWITCH, PART OUT OR "CREATE" PW abortions!
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
PostPosted: Wed Jun 03, 2015 7:21 pm Reply with quote
KennyHabeeb
Chapter Member
Joined: 22 Jan 2015
Posts: 975




What would that be, Jon?

I got into an argument on another Chap board about this same subject, arguing for leaving the case alone. The other guy claimed that people buy shiny before all else. It was apparently a stand-off in that crowd. Ah well.

K.
View user's profile Send private message
PostPosted: Wed Jun 03, 2015 7:36 pm Reply with quote
gemeyr4
Chapter Member
Joined: 11 Jun 2009
Posts: 1788
Location: Morgan Hill CA




Shinny is only good if it is virgin shinny. Laughing

_________________
George
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
PostPosted: Wed Jun 03, 2015 7:48 pm Reply with quote
interstatetime
Chapter Officer
Joined: 03 Dec 2002
Posts: 3266
Location: Indiana




KennyHabeeb wrote:
What would that be, Jon?

I got into an argument on another Chap board about this same subject, arguing for leaving the case alone. The other guy claimed that people buy shiny before all else. It was apparently a stand-off in that crowd. Ah well.


Kenny, some people do buy shiny....but you and most of the rest of us prove that a lot of people don't. It is interesting that in the wristwatch market this fight goes on too. There is a lot of mocking of shiny people. There are also a lot of people who are very good at restoring the factory finish to stainless and solid gold cases. I know one guy who is so good at it that given he starts with the right case you probably can't tell. Watches like this are lies.

I am not as much of a purist as some. I will, clean all but the most perfect or most valuable gold cases. I don't generally take metal off, there is nothing like the original factory edges, but unless there is something special about the schmutz I don't mind cleaning it off. Mr Hanson has gotten me to like and value the schmutz on a few of my special pieces though. Cool

_________________
John Cote (Member #105)
Membership Chairman - Ch-149
Past President - Ch-18
http://www.interstatetime.com
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
brightness doesn't make a watch prettier or better cond.
PostPosted: Wed Jun 03, 2015 9:14 pm Reply with quote
Jon
Chapter President
Joined: 02 Dec 2002
Posts: 25590
Location: Boston, Ma




KennyHabeeb wrote:
What would that be, Jon?

I got into an argument on another Chap board about this same subject, arguing for leaving the case alone. The other guy claimed that people buy shiny before all else. It was apparently a stand-off in that crowd. Ah well.

K.


Mr Hanson speaks: Some morons actually think shin-ny makes the watch (case) better condition--therefore, the brighter the better! WRONG! Condition has to do with wear and most folks who "MAKE THEIR WATCHES SHIN-NY" ACTUALLY RUIN THEIR CASE AS TO WEAR."

For example:

1. they polish--wrong; polishing diminishes the metal

2. they buff--wrong: as above, and it rounds corners

3. they dip--wrong; dipping products have an acid and acid eats the metal

4. #3 above could actually rust, ruin the stem, case springs or the hinge pins

On another form some newbies (and oldies) like EVERYTHING shin-ny, from pants to instrument horns, to hair, to cars--I say go buy them or some shin-ny jewelry and stay away from antique watches. Better yet, ruin some clocks--buff them up inc. the movements!

How can shin-ey make anything prettier--these cases have little or no character.

Which would you rather have a near new toned and patinated case or a shin-ny worn out piece of junk?

Lastly, it you can't stand a smudge--use a little Ivory soap and warm water but STAY AWAY FROM THE POLISH, BUFF AND THE DIP!

All of this brings up an old story about Sid Prescott (spell?). This old guy, Sid, for decades (many years ago) spent his time attending most of the watch shows and his speciality was gold multicolored cases, among other things. He carried 4-6 cases of watches around with him in these wooden show cases with glass tops with the watches on a hook. Moving these watches in and out of the car, driving with them moving everywhichway and into marts took a toll on his gold watches; after 10 years or less I noticed that the watches kept getting more and more ugly as all the detail was wearing off. At the end before his reported robbery no one would look at his watches, as they were always overpriced anyway. (No idiot would even buy a worn out multi at 2-3X its value.) I do not remember what happened to Sid's watches but I suspect they all got melted. Before they were reportedly stolen THEY SURE STAYED SHIN-NY!

_________________
Jon "the truth" Hanson
Founder and President of Chapter 149--the leading horological collectors' club!
American Horologe Co -- America's Most Respected Name
SUPPORT ETHICAL PRACTICES IN HOROLOGY--Keep watches original--DO NOT SWITCH, PART OUT OR "CREATE" PW abortions!
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
PostPosted: Wed Jun 03, 2015 10:56 pm Reply with quote
Ben_hutcherson
Chapter Member
Joined: 17 Feb 2010
Posts: 2282
Location: Frankfort, KY




I was at Louisville two or three years ago and and a pretty unremarkable watch(I think it was an 1880s 7j Elgin KW) in a really nice "beaded edge" 3oz coin case with beautiful patina on it.

One guy who always comes and bugs me at this show finally bought the watch from me, and tried to beat me down on the price after he'd picked it up because he was "going to have to go up to his room and polish it." I about grabbed the watch back out his hands and gave his money back, but held his tongue.

I think I finally managed to make him mad enough last year over $5 on a National that I wouldn't budge on("it doesn't have a key") and finally just told him that I wasn't going to sell it to him that he doesn't bug me anymore. It was sort of funny because after he walked out of the mart room in a huff, two or three people around me(who'd watched our half hour argument over $5) applauded. I don't like doing people that way, but there are special cases.
View user's profile Send private message
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2015 12:01 am Reply with quote
StephanG
Friend of 149
Joined: 06 Nov 2008
Posts: 4601
Location: Melbourne Australia




Alas the experts give a different view on polishing silver

http://www.lapada.org/p/advice-%26-information/care-of-antiques/silver

http://www.925-1000.com/aPolish.html

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/roadshow/tips/polishingmetals.html

I can see how new players get confused.

_________________
Learning all the time.

Proud member of CH149 and Global Horology
View user's profile Send private message
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2015 12:15 am Reply with quote
KennyHabeeb
Chapter Member
Joined: 22 Jan 2015
Posts: 975




No, I think they sound pretty similar to what Jon wrote, with added words for the folks who want non-tarnished silverware.
I bet if they were standing with us, there would be no disagreement.
View user's profile Send private message
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2015 1:23 am Reply with quote
Ben_hutcherson
Chapter Member
Joined: 17 Feb 2010
Posts: 2282
Location: Frankfort, KY




My friend Jerome lives and breathes American coin silver, and has a collection that probably rivals anything you'd find in a museum.

http://www.oldsouthsilver.com/

I've had many discussions with him about silver polishing, and he too says "leave it alone" almost all the time.
View user's profile Send private message
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2015 4:34 am Reply with quote
StephanG
Friend of 149
Joined: 06 Nov 2008
Posts: 4601
Location: Melbourne Australia




I look at it from a different point of view.

I consider myself a conservationist so I ask myself is there something here worth conserving.

Is it new, original, sharp, has a history of note, etc etc.

If the answer is yes leave it alone.

If you have to panel beat the thing or it is already worn smooth from use and has no history then polish away.

_________________
Learning all the time.

Proud member of CH149 and Global Horology
View user's profile Send private message
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2015 5:41 am Reply with quote
interstatetime
Chapter Officer
Joined: 03 Dec 2002
Posts: 3266
Location: Indiana




Ben_hutcherson wrote:
I was at Louisville two or three years ago and and a pretty unremarkable watch(I think it was an 1880s 7j Elgin KW) in a really nice "beaded edge" 3oz coin case with beautiful patina on it.

One guy who always comes and bugs me at this show finally bought the watch from me, and tried to beat me down on the price after he'd picked it up because he was "going to have to go up to his room and polish it." I about grabbed the watch back out his hands and gave his money back, but held his tongue.

I think I finally managed to make him mad enough last year over $5 on a National that I wouldn't budge on("it doesn't have a key") and finally just told him that I wasn't going to sell it to him that he doesn't bug me anymore. It was sort of funny because after he walked out of the mart room in a huff, two or three people around me(who'd watched our half hour argument over $5) applauded. I don't like doing people that way, but there are special cases.


Ha Ha...I think I know who you are talking about...

_________________
John Cote (Member #105)
Membership Chairman - Ch-149
Past President - Ch-18
http://www.interstatetime.com
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2015 10:21 am Reply with quote
geno
Chapter Member
Joined: 28 Oct 2005
Posts: 1610




Years ago I had a 18K Patek Minute Hunter, plain polish but with that beautiful old soft Patina. The movement needed cleaning and I sold it as is. The guy I sold it to came back months later saying how great the chimes were and how the movement really sparkled. He showed the watch and I could now see my face on the outside covers buffed to Hell. He was happy but to me it looked like S+++ and probably killed about $2-3000 of the value and some people would not want it all. I Never touch old Patina. Geno
View user's profile Send private message
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2015 1:04 pm Reply with quote
Jon
Chapter President
Joined: 02 Dec 2002
Posts: 25590
Location: Boston, Ma




Gold cases are best left alone. Over time there is a slight toning or dulling due to the other components in the mixture of metals. While silver will tone faster over a long period of time, gold takes even longer. Remember, not much affects gold (have you ever read about rare coins buried in the ocean that accumulate a crustacean that can be removed, not spoiling the original mint lustre?).

BEWARE: some clowns actually use a sulfur mix to tone down silver coins and cases.

The only thing I can think of to clean, silver wise, would be sterling used at the dinner table! (and, of course, some ladies' bracelets and earrings--much better to buy gold)

Tagline: The ladies do get some of their gold jewelry buffed due to nicks and damage banging the stuff into showcases and tables while shopping.

_________________
Jon "the truth" Hanson
Founder and President of Chapter 149--the leading horological collectors' club!
American Horologe Co -- America's Most Respected Name
SUPPORT ETHICAL PRACTICES IN HOROLOGY--Keep watches original--DO NOT SWITCH, PART OUT OR "CREATE" PW abortions!
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2015 1:27 pm Reply with quote
Neilywatch
Chapter Member
Joined: 16 Oct 2010
Posts: 5177




Jon wrote:
Tagline: The ladies do get some of their gold jewelry buffed due to nicks and damage banging the stuff into showcases and tables while shopping.


You're dating yourself with this remark - now we see women coming in the store with jewelry that they wear jogging, rock climbing and weight lifting. They are completely trashed, and when we tell them this stuff was not made to wear for such activity - they get VERY offended.

_________________
Neil - Crazy for Walthams!
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2015 1:54 pm Reply with quote
gemeyr4
Chapter Member
Joined: 11 Jun 2009
Posts: 1788
Location: Morgan Hill CA




[quote= they get VERY offended.[/quote]

Neil, are you offending the women again??

Laughing

_________________
George
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
case cleaning Chapter 149 discussion--here we go again!
WORLDWIDE Chapter 149 Message Board Forum Index » Case Discussions
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum
All times are GMT - 6 Hours  
Page 1 of 4  
Goto page 1, 2, 3, 4  Next
  
  
 Post new topic  Reply to topic  


Contact Us
©2006 NAWCC Chapter 149 "Early American Watch Club". OWNER.
FREE Web Hosting and Web Design provided by Web Horology

Powered by phpBB © 2001-2004 phpBB Group
phpBB Style by Vjacheslav Trushkin